RE: A little bleach won't hurt my grass, will it?
I am a retired house painter. We washed-down houses with STRONG Clorox solutions (sometimes a quart to 2 gals of water for stubborn mildew) right over delicate flowers and ornamentals and never had a problem. Shrubbery we ignored, but we would rinse-of delicate looking plants with clean water afterwards. It definitely won't hurt grass!
Jack
RE: Camping as opposed to motel.
Huck:
The human psychology should be obvious - when people are priced out of a market, they naturally resent those who can still afford it and want them to give it up too! It's just human nature - how people adjust to adversity. Misery loves company. In our case, we could "afford" the $5 fuel - it's more the principle of the thing! Forking over a hundred bucks every morning for a few gallons of %$^&# diesel oil takes all the fun out of it for guys like me and Chuckster. A lot of guys just resent being ripped-off, Huck.
We setup our trailer as a permanent camp, with an aluminum cover over it and a big wood deck, in a local rv park (www.triplecreekrv.com) that caters to amateur country/bluegrass musicians and singers. Lots of fun every weekend, with a music show that rivals Nashville, great barbecue and potluck and good fellowship. We could buy fuel for one weekend trip a month for what the camp costs, but we feel like we're getting some value for our money instead of just pouring it down that bottomless fuel tank and feeling like a victim every time we fillup!
Problem is that most of the musicians have rv's and many, who live in East Texas and Western Louisiana, are not coming anymore - because of fuel costs. We used to get several wonderful cajun music groups (classic songs in french, fiddles, accordions, etc - I loved it) from southern LA regularly. But no more - they're staying home due to fuel prices. On our monthly bluegrass weekend, the park used to fillup with 50 or 60 rigs - now we're lucky if we get 4 or 5 in addition to to those few that keep their rv's there like us. We still have a good time, but the park owner isn't making any money - probably not even breaking even.
This fuel thing is just killing every segment of the rv business - from manufacturing to campgrounds.
Jack
RE: Camping as opposed to motel.
I can't stand motels either. I'm not all that paranoid about "germs" and the like, and I can eat most anything - it's just no fun once you've travelled in an RV. Not having a bathroom and refrigerator convenient all day is intolerable for us now.
Just a couple years ago when diesel was $1.50 and rv parks averaged about 20 bucks, we could tow 300 mile a day for $40 in fuel and get a nice rv park for $20. As fuel and campgrounds went up, we hung-in there as long as we could - but when fuel hit $3.50 and the average price of rv parks increased, it seemed to us, by $10/night we had to quit. We parked the trailer and gave it all up - with great sadness.
We can drive the same 300 miles a day with our little car on 8 gals of gas and get a respectable "mom&pop" motel for around $60 in rural Texas. The problem is that we are so spoiled by the convenience of the TT that we just don't enjoy that anymore.
So we stay home now and have taken-up gardening instead of rv'ing - and it's lots of fun too. I agonized over the decision, but just couldn't justify dipping into our retirement capital to buy diesel oil for sightseeing.
Warmest regards to all our old rv'ing friends here on the forum. I'm not around much anymore.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Dick --
Those posts were indeed on topic. They were not offensive and apropos to the topic at hand. They took many hours to compose. A private message would not seem like too much of a courtesy. I am very disappointed in your judgment and will not be participating further.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Hello, Bob from Wales:
Alas, all is indeed lost as far as rv'ing is concerned here - at least for the overwhelming majority of rv enthusiasts on this side of the pond. Some have exited gracefully and parked their rig in a permanent campsite while others have chosen to fight history to the bitter end. It's all over, Bob. Even those fortunate few who have the money will not be driving their rigs because public opinion will be so negative and hostile toward them - not to mention their own feelings of guilt in wasting a precious commodity in short supply.
There is much weeping and gnashing of teeth, and some have vowed to fight on, but it's all over. The Age of Petroleum is drawing to a close, my friend.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Nobody will be rv'ing with $10 gas. It will be illegal. Every vehicle will be issued a ration sticker with even or odd numbers, and will only be able to fuel at designated locations on even or odd days according to the last digit of the vin or registration number - no private vehicle will be able to buy more than 5 gals every other day --- or etc.
The social ramifications of $10 gas are beyond my comprehension. In my rural area, there simply are no jobs. People have to drive 100 miles a day in order to work, and they are already barely able to survive with gas bills of $600/month +. They will either have to move closer to their work or languish here in the kind of appalling rural poverty I remember as a child. And moving closer to work is nearly impossible for most because housing prices down in the Beaumont area are way beyond their means. These are modestly paid people with family incomes under 50K - in many cases, way under! The nearest full service medical facility is 60 miles from here and older people living on SS alone cannot buy gas to keep doctor appointments.
The whole country, which was built on the automobile and cheap gas, will have to be restructured along European lines - and that will take time. What worries me is the social chaos that will inevitably ensue while this restructuring is taking place.
It wouldn't be so bad if it had developed slowly, over a period of years, to allow people time to adapt. But this sudden, dramatic increase is more than
millions of Americans can cope with.
The TV pundits are saying this will be the #1 issue in the fall campaign. Congress will be addressing it next session, and they will have to come-up with some plan to provide basic gas to lower income, working people - maybe issue some sort of "gas stamps" that allow the worker a few gallons a week of govt subsidized gasoline.
That's probably what we should be discussing here - How congress can deal with this evolving crisis in America. It's a complicated issue that will not be resolved without firm government action - the people will demand that "something be done" after the election. Congressional inaction could well mean the end of the America we have known. If Congress is indecisive and does nothing, the people will take the matter into their own hands and the result would likely be a completely socialized economy and the death of the American free enterprise system. The capitalists hated FDR - but he was the best friend they ever had. If he hadn't taken action at that terrible time, capitalism in America would probably be an historical footnote today.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Hi Slowlane (How 'bout a name - Bob, George - anything but Sue) :)
No, I won't be leaving; now that the conversation seems to have found a new life. It looked like we were all through over the weekend - maybe because everyone is doing this at work on company time. :)
I'll try to get my thoughts together and post something coherent on this govt/private question. I see merit in what you are saying, but I am admittedly ambivalent on the issue. Maybe it's not an either/or deal. Maybe some R&D from both govt and industry is the way to go. I think you are too cynical regarding govt. Without FDR's economic revolution, and subsequent Democrat administrations who built upon it, I could not have lived the happy, prosperous life I have. After WWII, this country achieved the greatest prosperity for the greatest number in the history of the world - and that could not have happened without the active role of govt. The union-busting and deregulation of the eighties was a setback for American workers, but the economy was strong enough for us to survive it intact. I see a situation developing now, however, with gasoline and heating oil that will require the govt step-in agressively and take charge of the whole mess.
It is government's responsibilty to assure that the people have access to basic needs - a roof over their head, medical care, electricity, food, schooling for their children. FDR eastablished that concept as a fundamental part of American democracy. Whether gasoline fits that category is arguable, but I suspect that it does. In which case govt must make sure that working people have sufficient fuel, at affordable prices, to heat their homes, cook ther meals, go to work, the doctor and the store. I expect the Feds, at the very least, to meet that responsibility with whatever action it takes - rationing, price controls - even flat-out nationalization of the industry if that's the only way.
I do not consider my elected representatives to be motivated by greed or empire-building. I believe they have my interest at heart. They have not let me down in the past. When the chips are down, they have always come through for us and I believe they will again.
Jack
RE: Generator - Microwave Question
Definitely a problem with the cycles. I've been there. Now I run a Honda 3000 super-quiet unit and it's always right on the money. Clocks, computers - any sort of electronics - run perfectly. But it costs $2000+.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Dick - Looks like it's all over here. We've said everything we have to say. Thanks again for all your extra work in monitoring a very difficult thread. It helped all of us deal with this terrible blow to our rv'ing pastime.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Thank you, Slowlane. Excellent response. What a pleasure and privilege it is to be able to engage in controversial dialogue with well-informed ladies and gentlemen.
We seem to be confronted by the classical question of American politics, upon which our two parties are traditionally based - what economic role should govt play? As children of the Great Depression, most working class Texans of my generation are still New Deal Democrats at heart, and still see government as best representing our interests on questions like this one - despite the fact that we have been forced to choose between our pocketbook and our Bible at the ballot box for forty years - and the Bible wins in Texas, a solid "red" state. I have no political home, with one foot in each party, and my long association with Republicans allows me to understand your reliance on free enterprise to pull us out of this crisis.
My information is based only on news stories and TV documentaries, but I am under the impression that petroleum reserves are rapidly depleting and that we'll be facing major shortages within a couple of decades. Others claim we have a hundred years of oil left to pump. The truth on that probably lies between the two warring factions, but it is a finite resource, it does pollute the environment, and it's days are clearly numbered - the only question is how long it will last.
In any case, whatever the time frame, prudence demands that we begin to prepare for ever-increasing shortages and seek alternatives to this vital commodity. Since alternative energy is such a long-term program, with no immediate profit rewards, it seems to me that govt is much better positioned to fund this basic research. Isn't that a sensible position, Slowlane?
You are absolutely right - there is no other way to power an aircraft, locomotive or 18-wheeler at this time. If we wait until the basic research becomes economically viable for free enterprise to make the massive investments, it may be too late. If we run-out of oil without alternatives, we will see an economic and social collapse of literally biblical proportions.
Like most issues, the actual truth probably lies somewhere between our respective positions.
I'll have a Bud Light. :)
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Slowlane - I certainly agree that the 15th century Spanish monarchy was motivated by pure greed, like modern entrepreneurs, but it was still a government program funded by TAX Dollars (or pesos). And I really don't think there would have been any space program had it not been for govt funding. I thought it was a waste of money at the time but I was wrong.
Atomic fusion has the potential of providing a clean and cheap source of unlimited energy and R&D must be continued, but private industry will not and cannot do it. The technology is at the point where researchers must have a "super collider" to proceed and Congress wisely appropriated $5 billion to build one at Waxahachie, TX several years ago. Land was acquired and construction began, but then Congress, responding to their short-sighted constituents, cut-off the funding and the project shut-down - after several hundred million had been spent. And there it sits - the ultimate, and perhaps the only, answer to the energy needs of the future is now nothing more a hole in the ground in rural Texas - not as a monument to govt boondoggle, but rather to our own narrow interpretation of our immediate self-interest. If it had been a private project - which is impossible in the first place - shareholders would have shut it down in the same way.
People don't see beyond their immediate situation and are not inclined to support what appears to be "pie-in-the-sky" science - like space travel. That's why strong political leadership and extensive govt involvement is the only way to assure the energy needs of the future.
Along with nuclear fusion, the research on super conductivity must continue as well. If they can find the right alloy for wires, our electricity consumption would immediately be cut in half. There is no way private industry will rise to this challenge because such an alloy might not even exist. It is presently publicly-funded at the university level, but we need an infusion of serious federal dollars for research because our time is running-out. Petroleum fuels are fading into history. We need a pragmatic partnership between govt and industry. Both have a vital role to play. Like in the New Deal era of the 30's, we need to ignore the political ideologues and tight-fisted taxpayers and do what works.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Dan:
Government has to do some things - like basic research and development on new technologies. Private industry simply cannot invest in questionable ventures that may or may not succeed and will show no short-run return The space program is a good example. Govt develops and industry applies.
I daresay there wasn't a single private investor in all of Europe who would have funded Columbus's hair brain voyage to the Orient by sailing West! Government had to do it - and reaped rich returns from their investment.
Government has a vital role to play in solving this crisis, although they rarely work fast enough, or efficiently enough, to satisfy us.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
It sounds like like a great idea, ML, but Dan's right. They'll just move to some island somewhere and continue thir trading.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Dan in NM:
I have no sympathy with the environmentalists - zero! But it seems to me that we would be better served by massive federal/private investment on alternative energy - namely, nuclear electric. There is a future for tar and shale but it will be primarily used for chemicals and plastics. It takes too much energy to refine into a usable fuel and it's only a stop-gap measure anyway. We will probably have to drill in ANWR and offshore Florida/Calif just to survive long enough to make the switch from petroleum to electricity - and will have to pay ever steeper prices for foreign oil.
It's clear to anyone with historical knowledge and social vision that the Age of Petroleum is in it's death throes. When my great grandkids take their children to the Auto Museum in MI, they will see the old, heavy, inefficient, smelly internal combustion engines and laugh at how big and awkward they were - like the 19th century mining tools at the museum in Tombstone Ariz!! "Did people really have those in cars, Daddy?"
We shouldn't think we can solve this with drilling for more oil - we can buy more time, that's all. World reserves are depleting and those remaining are located in hostile areas. We MUST make the change to an all-electric society and we had better get started. Civilization itself may be at stake here - never mind the health of the planet.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Dick, campfire chat always wanders. The important thing here is that we respond when someone posts on-topic. We're just killing time waiting for a relevant oil-related post and then we will return to work.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Hi, "rather be travlin" from Tyler - right up the road! More famous as the home of former Houston Oiler Earl Cambell than for roses. :)
Awhile back, I suggested that an oil crash like '84 might be a good thing - but I was shot down and proved wrong. Tell Topflite you are praying for a crash and see what he says.
Jack
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
I also think the web is contributing to the ideological fracturing of our society. It provides extremists on both ends of the political spectrum with a certain legitimacy that would have been unthinkable in our pre-computer world. All the porn material, chat rooms and dating services are damaging families and homes in a variety of ways and children are at great risk online - not only physically and emotionally, but morally as well.
But I guess everything has a downside. There are so many positive things about the web - unlimited shopping options, a huge library of information on every subject imaginable at your finger tips and educational and self-improvement opportunities for the unlettered masses that have the potential of obliterating ignorance worldwide.
We have to take the bad along with the good, I suppose - like TV and everything else.
Jack
RE: Fuel Rants & Raves - Post 'Em Here!
Wouldn't it take a court order or something to get that info from the IPS. I mean, you can't just call them up and ask who XXX is. You have to be a law enforcement agency, right?
Supposing someone posts some really slanderous material about me on an "anything goes" website, and I ask my attorney to sue him - could my attorney readily get the e-mail address and personal info of the person if the website administrator is uncooperative? And I'm sure that IPS's don't give that info with just a phone call or letter.
I think it needs regulation - should be like a newspaper where anonymous letters to the editor are not allowed. But I don't have any idea HOW it could be regulated, at least without serious infringments of free speech. Much of the Web is just a filthy cesspool that, in my old-fashioned opinion, should be cleaned-up! I grew up in a day when a single profane word over a marine radio would result in your license being revoked by the FCC.
I guess the answer is just to stay on well-moderated sites like this one, where such posts are quickly deleted and the member expelled. Trouble is, many sites aren't moderated at all! Seems like the modern equivalent, I guess, of staying out of bad neighborhoods and being selective in the company you keep.
Jack
